That means you have to be skeptical about whether any PR person is capable of personalization and optimization. Do they have the experience and mental habits to improve the results of their Social Media communications?

Theres really not much difference between the PR opportunist shifting to Social Media, and the Real Estate agent, out of work due to the housing bust, getting into Social Media. In ct, you could argue that real estate agents are better conversationalists when it comes to talking to the average American.

The rational justification was that public relations has always been involved with communicating to the public, so it would make sense for them to do so through Social Media. But in the same breath, theyll tell you that Social Media is all about conversation and listening.

Dig it, it supports more than a few ideas I have been trying to get across to the CEO of the Real Estate Firm I work for. I wear a few hats for the company including IA, Web-Development, and Social Media Guy..(I hesitate to say I am an expert or guru..) It has been an uphill battle to drive a solid point home. Social Media is for building communities and creating Meaning, not just a place you can paste and slap, ad over ad. Thanks for the read :)

Lower Effectiveness: Confusion in corporate organization and control issues which decrease effectiveness of Social Media for the corporation

From a broad overview it seems obvious that there are two main types of traffic.

But there is a type of PR person in Social Media that Ill call the Ignorant Opportunist, and these are the people who are hurting Social Media.

Brian is author of The Like Economy: How Businesses Make Money With Facebook and Facebook Marketing: Leveraging Facebooks Features For Your Marketing Campaigns, How to Get More Fans on Facebook, and LinkedIn For Business: How Advertisers, Marketers and Salespeople get Leads, Sales and Profits from LinkedIn Brian has 12 years experience as a freelance consultant and digital marketing agency director. His hands-on business experience, cutting edge insights, background in improv and stand up comedy culminate in a keynote speaker, and social media trainer who leaves every audience not only entertained, but armed with powerful strategies and tactics.

I love this it puts the focus back on the need for Social Media practices to transcend the traditional silo effect internal to most companies. It also highlights the ct that the person at the helm of your Social Media initiatives cant fit into the current org chart neatly. S/he has to be able to work with multiple departments and not answer to one specific hierarchy.

Where do you base the ct that PR practitioners dont measure and evaluate? Have you ever seen as legitimate PR strategic campaign? It is composed of measurable objectives, coupled with an evaluation plan (post-campaign) to measure the results of the campaign. Social Media is not PR for us practitioners, it is merely a tool of communication, a tactic.

I think it is a bit too controversial saying that PR people are destroying social media. Even tho the traditional marketers have been listening to their customers from analytics and such, it doesnt mean that PR people cant do a better job after proper training. In ct PR people are more equipped with people skill to engage better than most of the digital marketers.

They also have seen directly in the data how different messages and copy have different effects on the audience. PR people have never had the kind of direct feedback they need to be sure that their message is received properly, is interesting, and achieves the result the corporation wants.

Then look at how Japan and Brazil are catching up in social media use.

No Bottom-Line Results: De-emphasis on measurement and results, lack of critical thinking and lack of strategic creativity to achieve them

PR ppl need to read wiki brands its a good guide for anyone to understand how to effectively build a brand on line.

(Admittedly, I worked at a full-service marketing agency so perhaps the PR offering was a bit more well-rounded than others. I should also point out that these are not people who are like your social media expert mates.)

What a bunch of malarkey. Without Twitter and FB, Social Media doesnt exist. And if you think these two platforms will be with us much longer, youre sadly mistaken.

Im not saying all PR people are destroying Social Media. I consider a number of Social Media experts with PR backgrounds to be friends of mine Social Media, and I converse with them regularly.

Sorry Brian, you simply got it very wrong this time.

Why PR People Cannot Oversee And Control All Corporate Social Media

And finally for the fundamental marketing mistake: You guys are too affirmative. You only ask, what Communication incl. Social Media can do for the company. However, in the new media world, we have to ask what a company (or a brand) can do communicatively. Its that, what makes them social. Its their public relations, shaped by communication.

Facebook and Twitter are the easy answers for anyone thats thinking top-level social media platforms, but theres a heck of a lot more to the medium than these two darlings.

No background in web analytics or marketing

When I created a system for B2B Social Media Sales &o everyone likes Twitter, right? Well they should. We just need to get more of these people onto Twitter.

I think your point here was to generate some conversation and I give you kudos on that but I do think you have a very restricted view on what public relations professionals can and DO participate in on a daily basis that makes them just as good a fit as any marketers, sales professional, etc. Its less about your background and more about a passion to learn and just generally understanding the landscape and how to make it work for YOUR brand or clients.

Wow.

These are very broad accusations (PR not listening, for example, or using web analytics), and your analogy between a PR professional and a real estate agent, frankly is weak at best. Your logic is flawed and your reasoning is so one-sided that it hurts your credibility. Next time, I suggest you talk to more PR people before such hasty assumptions and weak conclusions.

Oh yes, marketing people dont like talking as it would mean they would have to think before. Marketing likes doing stuff. Not because it makes sense, but eases their ADHD.

Finally, the leaders of our own profession gathered last year to condemn ad equivalency, and PR Week no longer accepts it in consideration of awards. You wont hear the industry defending it.

I think you feel threatened as a marketer by the PR profession; this fuels your rant.

Hi Brian. I have to disagree with most of your points in this post. Ill start by saying I do agree there needs to be a holistic approach to social media for it to be the most successful, however, I dont think you should think all public relations professionals are inept at running social media programs.

Im yet to come into contact with a PR agency thats nailed measurement but its something that the industry seems to be changing, slowly (AVEs are practically illegal in the right PR circles now).

No background in web analytics or marketing

Wow, this rant is a lot of sense.

Why PR People Think Theyre The Best People For The Social Media Job, and Why They Arent

Ill say more about how theyre hurting Social Media later, but in brief:

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As Tom Murphy said, Social Media is not as complex as open heart surgery.

How would they replace this revenue with their existing skill base?

What Kind of Damage Is The PR Bias Doing To Social Media

What Does A Social Media Coordinator Need To Understand?

And Ill have to say that folks that are trying to turn this into a systematic function of business where theres is an equation to complete in every social interaction arent helping either.

It challenges the current structure so much one has to wonder which will il first the entrenched corporate structure, or their attempt to adapt to the 21st century.

You set up your channels to capture the traffic (yes, you can be good and bad at that), you do stuff with it (yes this is a very fluffy topic), you look at the metrics.

As Tom Murphy said, Social Media is not as complex as open heart surgery.

Social Media was the obvious answer. Especially since in its immature 2008 2009 form there was little agreement on how to measure Social Media or whether ROI was possible. PR people define themselves as communicators and arent comfortable with quantifying the effects of their communication. Or they just havent had the ability to do so (and AVEs are ridiculous.)

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As I wrote the other day, we have a bad habit of talking about Social Media as if its one monolithic thing, but its not. Social Media is used in a variety of ways according to function, and measured differently.

Line 4 5: that doesnt mean that PR people DONT have something that they can bring to the table

Wow theres a saying in the art world If youre not someone upset, then youre doing something wrong. This post definitely seems like that. However, then ensuing responses brought to a light a lot of good points. While it may be true that marketing people had a better foundation for analysing demographics and working the granulated conversation of social media, that doesnt mean that PR people have something that they can bring to the table if and when they learn how to integrate with the new paradigms of social media and understand that it is different in some ways from the ways in which they are used to communicating.

When I worked in PR for example, we would always use market research, surveys and market insight to inform our PR campaigns. Sometimes wed conduct our own. Many of the people I worked with were brilliant at coming up with creative ideas that worked with clients marketing strategy too.

You need both types of expert, theyre very different specialities, theyre very different species. Your article is basically saying theyre not a species suited to Social Media, but youre biased towards metrics. Help them, theyll help fill your channels, then measure away to your hearts content by all means.

They think all of Social Media belongs under the PR umbrella

Thats a really narrow view of social media, and from a very tunnel-visioned North American view at that.

- Lower Effectiveness: Confusion in corporate organization and control issues which decrease effectiveness of Social Media for the corporation

Its obvious how they are opportunists. Public relations for the average companySocial Media has been on the decline for years (reference 1, 2, 3), and as internet marketing and analytics-based marketing grew from 2005 to 2009 (check out ANY of the charts here), more and more agencies became alarmed.

Dividing audiences by intent and addressing them granularly rather than as one large group. This is closer to the type of personalization required in Social Media.

Sometimes I grapple with this issue myself, thinking that it is turning SO commercial on social media that it might just be watering the concept down

Sorry, if were not in supporting the control phantasies of Execs. Good Execs (and PR) already know, that they lost it. Its the ability to act despite that, which makes good leaders.

Ignorant opportunists? I think youre the pot calling the kettle black.

I think a lot of what needs to be said has already been stated by tHow PR People Are Destroying Social Mediahe other commenters, but Brian, Im sorry, I just think youve presented a terribly distorted view of how we do public relations and how a lot of the leading firms do it. I acknowledge that there are PR hacks out there too but theyre not the ones driving the leading programs.

Opportunism Due to Decline in Demand For PR

Whats a Bottom-Line Result other than a perfect set of share- and stakeholder delusion? Intelligent PR knows that and establishes strategic narratives, that make even marketeers believe, that they can measure what they do. The truth is, theres only one Bottom-Line, the one of the business. It either makes profit, or looses money. Except for corporate bulling and creating elaborate lies for the controllers, no one needs measurement.

Take a look at the growth of Tudou in China; or Xing in mid-Europe; or Fotolog in South America.

They think all of Social Media belongs under the PR umbrella

Great article.

There are a lot of people over internet that we can call as Ignorant Opportunist, your article help us to know how recognize them

Ha, ha, the most powerful change agent for executives is not Social Media ROI but their kids. Daddy, why is you company not on Facebook is the killer phrase.

But still gotta say, PR people you have a long way to catch up with the digital marketers who have been studying thousands and thousands of real business cases through years of data collection and analysis.

I suppose my point, if I have one, is that I think that someone with commercial nous, who understands business,new york escort whos not afraid of learning new things, who is bright and articulate regardless of background would make a good social media co-ordinator.

Where do you base the ct that PR practitioners dont measure and evaluate? Have you ever seen as legitimate PR strategic campaign? It is composed of measurable objectives, coupled with an evaluation plan (post-campaign) to measure the results of the campaign. Social Media is not PR for us practitioners, it is merely a tool of communication, a tactic.

If PR-People are such dumbs, why bash them. If they are so obviously iling, just dont even bother. But maybe theres a deeper truth in all that,and if there is, we may find it in the battle damage assessment, ascribed to PR. And yes, theres a threat lurking. The clear and present danger of PR unmasking the marketing Apostles Creed:

Clarifications:

While a bad PR would pump out press releases pointlessly, a good one would find a relevant journalist to target, read everything theyd written to understand what might interest them, and shape their pitch to appeal to them (and hopefully in turn their readers). That sounds like the kind of personalised conversation you mention.

As someone whos worked both sides of the fence (digital agencies and PR agencies), I wanted to pick up on a couple of points. I think you might have come into contact with some pretty wack PRs on which youre basing many of these assumptions.

Less Executive Support: Obfuscation of the potential of Social Media ROI, discouraging it as a goal, decreasing the enthusiasm of executives for Social Media

It has become more common for public relations professionals to use the web (social media specifically) to publically relate. Thats to say much of the activity that goes on within social media, especially Twitter and blogs, only serves to reinforce certain professionals positions within the industry.

So here are the problems. Heres what will happen if PR people dominate Social Media:

This is by definition a controversial post and a bit of a rant. So I want to be clear what Im saying, and who towards and who Im not talking about.

Here are a few of the types of Social Media:

Social Media experts with only a PR background have no training or experience in advertising, marketing, sales, or customer service, but these are essential functions of Social Media. They cannot control all corporate Social Media without more training and experience.

Line 2: THE ensuing responses not then.

If you walked into a night club and started marketing, using local &his fuels your rant.

Controversial headline, but really well supported article. To add to your discussion, if any one department were to take over social media it could ruin it. Consider the Sales department. Talk about lack of relationship and trust building communication! If social media was only slammed with deals and discounts, how st do you think youd lose your audience? I agree that it is essential social media be a well balanced mix of the different departments: customer service, HR, sales, PR and marketing.

So dont worry. PR will not take over Social Media.

At best, PR people are destroying Social Media _for marketers_!!

Rather than listening to customers and engaging the social aspect of the medium, certain professionals use the medium solely to establish their own personal brand as professionals. Perhaps you would argue this is a bad thing, but I believe this phenomenon only leads to greater understand about communication, people, and the forces shaping their behavior.

Just addressing the ct that PR has been doing SWA (Social Web Analytics) for several year. Obviously, Brian research is prejudiced or he could not understand the detailed studies.

PR has not been interested in another way that digital marketers listen to and understand customers: web analytics

Whomever controls or coordinates your Social Media needs to have a solid basis or at least an acquaintance with, and lack of disdain for all of the following:

One thing I will note that others havent is that your research supporting years of decline in PR shows no such thing. One shows a dip at the onset of the recession, with steady figures before that. Another shows almost as many increasing their budgets as holding them steady and almost nobody decreasing.

Being a bit rubbish at measuring results of social media isnt exclusive to PRs either. At a conference last week the head of social media for one of the biggest FMCG brands in the UK who came from a digital comms, not PR, background admitted that they hadnt yet been trying to measure their success in any meaningful way. And if a massive company with giant budgets to pour into sophisticated reporting hasnt bothered until now, it seems everyone has got a long way to go.

PR people define themselves as communicators and arent comfortable with quantifying the effects of their communication. This is simply an assumption at best and untrue at worst. Having worked with PR professionals, journalists and now internet marketers I can certainly see the strong links between PR and social media and myself vour the foundations in rationality that PR lends social media. It is certainly unir to make assumptions about PR professionals who take time and effort to measure the effects of their work.

Another thing I think you missed the mark on is this statement Social Media experts with only a PR background have no training or experience in advertising, marketing, sales, or customer service, but these are essential functions of Social Media. Unless these public relations folks never went to college, they have had training in these areas. Not to mention that we do work closely with other departments so we arent ignorant to how the advertising, marketing, sales or customer service worlds work.

Then there are things like SEO and web advertising, which arent PRs department. Doing only one will only capture a certain percentage of the traffic (one visitor might have done a google search, one visitor has read a story in the news),each method is targeting a unique audience with very little cross over, ergo youre increasing the reach.

Defensive and hostile much? Others here have already doen a fine job in pointing out the ignorant assumptions and claims in your post, so I wont repeat the obvious. Your bitter blog is an embarrassment to whatever credibility you may have had in this space. As CEO, I wouldnt hire you for the reason that you seem inept at the very thing you are preaching and social media seeks to accomplishlistening, relationship building and of course, mutual respect.

PR has not traditionally been involved in conversation, especially personalized intimate conversation. In ct, pushing press releases is exactly the kind of 1.0 push that they strongly recommend against.

Then tell me if theyre useless or not.

Well this one really got the peoples blood boiling. I think the PR the hurts the community is sort of the boy who cried wolf. PR done for link building with no headline value. I cam from a search marketing background and I love PR but you need to have something good to announce from time to time.

And unless theyre going to just be an order-taker, they need to understand the basics of business: what are its goals and priorities, how is it measured, and so on. If their priorities are different from the corporations and they have autonomy, that will create conflict.

Without Twitter and Facebook, social media doesnt exist.

No, first you go where they already are hanging out, be it Facebook, LinkedIn, or other.

Nice rant Brian.

First off, the type of public relations youre referring to is SOLELY media relations just one cet of public relations. Many PR practitioners have mounds of experience in community outreach and crisis which requires listening, conversation, research regarding messaging, etc. I do agree that generally communications folks arent as savvy in the measurement realm as marketers, but its something that is definitely a focus and that many practitioners do get thats why theyre in this business. Social media isnt for everyone.

Enjoy the ride for now, but if you dont see the issues and problems that these two entities are ced with, and their lack of understanding how to resolve them (i.e. make money and know where they will be in 5 years), then keep ranting about the hapless PR people.

- Too Much Talk: Over-emphasis on communication for the sake of communicating

Now as youre so good at metrics youll know precisely how effective your SEO and web advertising is, everything else is PR. Wheres your metric for how good PR are? Its not their job to collect metrics, they dont think about them..

Whats asinine about this entire post is the abundance of the phrase Social Media without any regard for what Social Media is: its social and thus _deliberately_ NOT commercial nor political. Whats destroying Social Media itself is people, like you, using it for non-social purposes.

First of all, I have to say I respectfully disagree that as a whole, PR people are destroying the industry. Id also like to point out that your perspective on the industry is skewed. Overgeneralization never helps an argument and many of your assumptions about what publc relations people do/dont do are simply untrue. Perhaps you were trying to ruffle feathers in the name of exposure. If so, touche.

- No Bottom-Line Results: De-emphasis on measurement and results, lack of critical thinking and lack of strategic creativity to achieve them

So dont worry. PR will not take over Social Media.

PR has not historically been involved in listening more than marketers have. Ever heard of market research? Marketing surveys?

In my of view who are all not having social media experience though only destroyed.. Really great article.. Thanks for sharing this..

As you can see, because of the breadth of Social Medias applications, your companys Director of Social Media should report to either the CEO or COO. They cannot report to the Director of Marketing or Sales if you have both of these. That would create conflicts. Its not a position that fits very well into the org chart because it has applications in so many departments.

They are blocking the growth and effectiveness of Social Media, and theyre confusing both the people who need to be using it and and the people who are paying for it.

Lets get real; Whether its PR people or self-proclaimed gurus, social media is destroying itself.

Typed and submitted ster than I could read

- Less Executive Support: Obfuscation of the potential of Social Media ROI, discouraging it as a goal, decreasing the enthusiasm of executives for Social Media

Theres traffic driven by word of mouth and traditional medium, like your casual news reader. To get that content into the publication (whether online or not) you need someone to read your content, then print it. PR is a contact network based on a mutually agreeable transaction, one party has content, one party needs content. Its overriding feature is that its free (if it isnt free, its marketing). This has huge reach, in my experience good PR is worth 10 times any other method of social traffic generation (I wasnt tweaking the tech all that much, in truth).

Is anyone listening to that and thinking about it?

Perhaps the most successful campaign my PR firm was involved in over the last couple years had virtually NOTHING to do with us thrusting emails or other content on them it was nurturing and managing a community of hundreds of bloggers that we knew made much more credible advocates for our client and led to bottom-line business results achieved. Nobody at our firm would contend that Twitter is a social media strategy. And frankly, long-term, I dont believe that any one person should own social media anyway, because it is so broad in covering internal communications, marketing, customer service, etc. Its a necessary interim step at many companies. I certainly believe in having a cross-disciplinary understanding to be successful in that role.

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